Audio by Shimi Berger

Mishnah Avodah Zarah 2:5: Rabbi Yehuda says: Rabbi Ishmael asked Rabbi Yehoshua [a question] as they were walking along the road. He said to him, "What is the cause for the prohibition against the cheese of non-Jews?" He said to him, "Because they curdle it inside the stomach of carrion." He said to him, "But is not [the law regarding] the stomach of a burnt offering more stringent than the stomach of carrion?! And they [the Sages] said: [It was proposed that] a priest with a good disposition may burn [a burnt offering after sucking out the fat from its stomach] while it it still raw [and has not yet been burnt with the offering, which would forbid one form deriving any benefit from it]. And they [the sages] did not agree with him [who proposed this opinion], but they said: One may not derive benefit [from the fats of the stomach], nor is one [who does so] liable for meilah [deriving prohibited benefit from from a sanctified object]." [Implying that one should therefore not be liable for the less stringent case of a stomach of carrion.] He [Rabbi Yehoshua] retracted, and [instead] said, "Because they curdle it in the stomachs of calves that were used for idolatry." And he [Rabbi Ishmael] said, "If so, why is there no prohibition to benefit from it?" He [Rabbi Yehoshua] redirected him to another topic. He said to him, "Ishmael, my brother, how do you read (Shir HaShirim 1): 'For dodechah [Heb. masc: "your love"] is better than wine,' or 'For dodayich [Heb. fem: "your love") is better than wine'? He said to him:, "'For dodayich is better than wine.'" He said to him, "The matter is not so. For its fellow [the following verse] teaches about it: 'For the fragrance of shemaneikha [Heb. masc: "your oils"] is good.'"

אמר רבי יהודה, שאל רבי ישמעאל את רבי יהושע כשהיו מהלכין בדרך. אמר לו, מפני מה אסרו גבינות של גוים.אמר לו, מפני שמעמידין אותה בקבה של נבלה.אמר לו, והלא קבת עולה חמורה מקבת נבלה ואמרו כהן שדעתו יפה שורפה חיה ולא הודו לו, אבל אמרו לא [אין] נהנין ולא מועלין. [חזר] אמר לו, מפני שמעמידין אותה בקבת עגלי עבודה זרה. אמר לו, אם כן, למה לא אסרוה בהנאה. השיאו לדבר אחר, אמר לו, ישמעאל אחי, היאך אתה קורא (שיר השירים א) כי טובים דדיך מיין, או כי טובים דודיך. אמר לו, כי טובים דודיך. אמר לו, אין הדבר כן, שהרי חברו מלמד עליו, לריח שמניך טובים.

Mishnah Avodah Zarah 2:6: These are the items of non-Jews that are prohibited, yet their prohibition is not against deriving benefit from them: milk that was milked by a non-Jew without a Jew watching, and [their] bread, and their oil [although] Rabbi and his court permitted [their] oil, and stewed vegetables, and pickled vegetables to which it is their custom to add wine and vinegar, and minced fish, and fish-brine that does not have kilbit [a kind of small fish] floating in it, and the chilaq fish, and a [cut] piece of asafoetida, and seasoned salt, all of these [items of non-Jews] are prohibited yet their prohibition is not against deriving any benefit from them.

אלו דברים של גוים אסורין ואין אסורן אסור הנאה, חלב שחלבו גוי ואין ישראל רואהו, והפת, והשמן שלהן. רבי ובית דינו התירו בשמן. ושלקות, וכבשין שדרכן לתת לתוכן יין וחמץ , וטרית טרופה, וציר שאין בה דגה כלבית שוטטת בו, והחילק, וקרט של חלתית, ומלח סלקונטית, הרי אלו אסורין ואין אסורן אסור הנאה.

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